<div dir="ltr"><div><div><div><div>dear all,<br><br></div>thank you very much for sharing your experiences. we will then certainly also follow the example of others in the field.<br></div>just to answer gabe's point about one potential way of misuse: a high-resolution map of course greatly facilitates model building. however, the resulting model will also be the best explanation for lower resolution data, one just would not have found this solution. it may take a pretty good reviewer to figure out that the lower resolution data do not justify the correct biological conclusions.<br>So let us just adhere the ethical principles we should and share the data.<br><br></div>cheers<br><br></div>friedrich<br><br><br><div><div><br><br></div></div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Apr 30, 2015 at 11:46 PM, Gabriel Lander <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:glander@scripps.edu" target="_blank">glander@scripps.edu</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div style="word-wrap:break-word">I would like to echo Eva & Ed’s comments (I am also NOT a reviewer).<div>Given that the EM field hasn’t really settled on a robust methodology to statistically assess the accuracy & validity of a density (yes we have gold standard FSC, local resolution plots, tilt-pair validation, etc. but these are not 100% foolproof, & there are ways to inflate resolution nonetheless), we generally rely on our eyes to ascertain the quality of map.</div><div><br></div><div>I’m sure your density doesn’t fall into this category of “inaccurate” structure determination, so I’m curious what you think a reviewer might do with your density to misuse it?</div><div>I agree with Ed that all densities should be uploaded with a submitted manuscript, and I am happy to do this for any manuscripts we send out.</div><div>-gabe</div><div><div class="h5"><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><div><blockquote type="cite"><div>On Apr 30, 2015, at 2:16 PM, Eva Nogales <<a href="mailto:enogales@lbl.gov" target="_blank">enogales@lbl.gov</a>> wrote:</div><br><div>
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
<font face="Helvetica Neue">Hi Friedrich,<br>
<br>
We got the same request and we provided the map and model as a
Chimera session to the editor and reviewer. I understand your
point, but we have to trust the system and understand where the
reviewers may be coming from. We do know of more than one example
where having had such access may have precluded publication of</font><font face="Helvetica Neue"><font face="Helvetica Neue"> some really
terrible structures</font>. It will be interesting to hear what
others think (and I have no doubt the reviewer(s) that asked for
your and our maps is/are within the list reading this email...)<br>
<br>
Eva<br>
</font><br>
<div>On 4/30/15 1:49 PM, Friedrich Foerster
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>dear colleagues,<br>
<br>
</div>
i would be interested in experiences / suggestions /
views of others in the field on the following issue
that may be of interest to many of us:<br>
</div>
the editor of our manuscript forwarded the request of a
peer-reviewer to access the cryo-em map of our beloved
complex. this has never happened to us, but to our
surprise the editor did not consider the request to be
unusual.<br>
of course, we share the point that the map would be of
great help in judging the interpretation of the data.
however, we also feel very uncomfortable sending the
condensed result of lengthy research to an anonymous
colleague, who could theoretically make considerable
misuse of it. nevertheless, the policy of the journal
seems to let us little choice: "<font size="2">Supporting
data must be made available to editors and peer</font><font size="2">-</font><font size="2">reviewers at the time of</font><font size="2"> submission for the purposes of evaluating the
manuscript.</font><font size="2"> Peer</font><font size="2">-</font><font size="2">reviewers</font><font size="2"> may be asked</font><font size="2"> to comment
on the terms of access to materials, methods and/or data
sets</font><font size="2">"</font>.<br>
</div>
in any case we would be curious whether others indeed got
similar requests and how they dealt with it. a good solution
for (paranoid?) people like us could be a good web-based
viewer that lets others view our map, but i would not know
of such a tool.<br>
<br>
</div>
Thanks <br>
<br>
</div>
Friedrich<br clear="all">
<div><br>
-- <br>
<div>Dr. Friedrich Foerster<br>
Max-Planck Institut fuer Biochemie<br>
Am Klopferspitz 18<br>
D-82152 Martinsried<br>
<br>
Tel: <a href="tel:%2B49%2089%208578%202632" value="+498985782632" target="_blank">+49 89 8578 2632</a><br>
Fax: <a href="tel:%2B49%2089%208578%202641" value="+498985782641" target="_blank">+49 89 8578 2641</a><br>
<br>
<a href="http://www.biochem.mpg.de/foerster" target="_blank">www.biochem.mpg.de/foerster</a><br>
</div>
<br>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<fieldset></fieldset>
<br>
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<br>
<pre cols="72">--
__________________________________________________________________
Eva Nogales
Howard Hughes Medical Institute
Molecular and Cell Biology Department
QB3, Stanley Hall 708C
University of California, Berkeley
Berkeley, CA 94720-3220
Phone: <a href="tel:%28510%29%20642-0557" value="+15106420557" target="_blank">(510) 642-0557</a> Fax: <a href="tel:%28510%29%20666-3336" value="+15106663336" target="_blank">(510) 666-3336</a>
URL: <a href="http://cryoem.berkeley.edu" target="_blank">cryoem.berkeley.edu</a>
<a href="tel:%28510%29%20666-3334" value="+15106663334" target="_blank">(510) 666-3334</a> Teresa Tucker, Assistant to Eva Nogales
Professor, UC Berkeley and Lawrence Berkeley Natl. Lab
__________________________________________________________________
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<br></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><br>-- <br><div class="gmail_signature">Dr. Friedrich Foerster<br>Max-Planck Institut fuer Biochemie<br>Am Klopferspitz 18<br>D-82152 Martinsried<br><br>Tel: +49 89 8578 2632<br>Fax: +49 89 8578 2641<br><br><a href="http://www.biochem.mpg.de/foerster" target="_blank">www.biochem.mpg.de/foerster</a><br></div>
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