[3dem] Elsa cryo holder

Thu Jun 13 09:22:37 PDT 2019

Nice! Hope the other users don't have to re-invent the wheels again. I
looked at the 3L pot more carefully and see the manufacturer is Huskey (not
Husky) and searched and saw the same pot on Amazon:

https://www.amazon.com/Insulated-Thermal-Coffee-Brushed-Stainless/dp/B00T2G550S

I'm pretty sure it is the same.

Best,
Haifeng

On Thu, Jun 13, 2019 at 11:54 AM Wim Hagen <hagen at embl.de> wrote:

> Here’s what we use to get through the night on our F30 for
> plastic-fantastic work, the dewar table allows even bigger dewars, the one
> in the picture lasts ten hours, we now use a bigger one.
>
>
> https://www.embl.de/services/core_facilities/em/equipment/tecnai_f30/index.html
>
> Best,
>
> Wim Hagen
> EMBL Heidelberg
>
> On 13. Jun 2019, at 17:45, Mariena Silvestry Ramos <ms3289 at cornell.edu>
> wrote:
>
> Hi Haifeng,
>
>
> I used to use an F20 with a modified cold trap (a larger dewar that would
> last most of the night if I recall correctly), and I think the vendor
> mentioned that since this was an after-market modification, they couldn't
> be held responsible for any issues we encountered with it. I can't remember
> the vendor who made said dewar and cover, and the plate where the dear is
> held also had to be modified (for a larger diameter).
>
>
> Just my two cents on using after-market dewars. Of course, that me only be
> the case for 120-200kV scopes of certain generations, and not more modern
> ones with auto-fillers.
>
>
> Also, thanks to everyone who chimed in on the boxes. Lots of good info.
>
>
> Mariena
> ------------------------------
> *From:* 3dem <3dem-bounces at ncmir.ucsd.edu> on behalf of Haifeng He <
> haifenghe at gmail.com>
> *Sent:* Thursday, June 13, 2019 11:37:37 AM
> *To:* Grassucci, Robert
> *Cc:* 3dem at ncmir.ucsd.edu
> *Subject:* Re: [3dem] Elsa cryo holder
>
> The other thread was talking about the 3D printing gridbox. It maybe
> helpful for other ELSA users if I put our solution for a bigger cold trap
> dewar here (more than 12 hours no problem) with a 3D printing of an adaptor
> for it to sit. However, I just found out the vender that we bought our 3L
> coffee pot from disappeared from the web. We ordered ours before the trade
> war, not sure if that's the cause. Anyway, the company that I found that
> offer a 3L coffee pot used to be here:
> https://www.mokeyinternational.com/item/?id=B01M14D29B
>
> See the attached for a matching adaptor's 3D printing file that this 3L
> pot sits on. This 3L pot is almost perfectly designed for the Technai
> TEM--even the old cap works with it. See an attached image for how it works
> in real world--the design works with the handle off--just my preference.
>
> In case you couldn't contact the vendor, I have a smaller 2L version of
> the cold trap with a matching 3D file. See attached. But the adaptor works
> with the handle intact. It maybe enough for the ELSA. And the link still
> works:
>
> https://www.webstaurantstore.com/choice-1-9-liter-insulated-thermal-coffee-server/922SA19X.html
>
> Regards,
> Haifeng
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Jun 13, 2019 at 10:45 AM Haifeng He <haifenghe at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> We have seen a few times contamination problems at the start of the day.
> We have done the following to minimize the issue: pre-cool ELSA at least
> half an hour before loading the grids. Also cool the cold trap even longer
> if you could. If you load your grids too soon, the temperature will rise
> significantly once you put it into the column (we believe the rod design
> difference is the cause). We still see contamination sometimes, but usually
> the 2nd one and on are ok. Due to our many users we also continuously use
> the ELSA no stop often. The previous user fill the LN at 11-12 pm, and the
> next user take over around 9ish in the morning no problem. Read bellow for
> more good and bad of the ELSA.
>
> In extreme, we got 11-12 hrs for ELSA to keep Cryo, 8-10 as a norm which
> allowed us to use it continuously. We bake out about once a week. The drift
> of ELSA is also very impressive: with active heating on, the drift is
> usually better than the 626.6.
>
> Now came to the bad part: we got pretty annoying resolution anisotropy
> (stage Y much worse than X). We played alot here on the V-grove but doesn't
> help that much. Gatan is not very helpful here either, their measurement of
> "resolution" (they use "interferometer" to measure some vibration kind of
> thing) showed ok. In comparison, the 626.6 holder shoot for better than
> 2.3A with a cross grating specimen easily on our F20 (their resolution spec
> is to be able to see the 2.3A Xgrating diff line on all directions). You
> may ask why the amazing drift rate of ELSA didn't help here? I believe it's
> some high frequency vibrations that the drift couldn't help with. For
> example, in the stage X direction, even if it is still drifting crazy and a
> bad summed Thon Ring, the MotionCorr corrected image recovered all the lost
> Thon Ring. The K2 is just amazing.
>
> We were thinking of buying another ELSA, but this resolution story
> hesitated us. In principle, due to the use of many particles, you may still
> be able to get high resolution, but with double or quadruple the number of
> particles than necessary on a better holder.
>
> *In short for potential buyers, if a long Cryo holding time is all you
> need, go for it, otherwise think again. But, I do hope we are the only
> exception. And frustratingly, Gatan didn't offer any help further.*
>
> Regards,
> Haifeng
>
>
> On Thu, Jun 13, 2019 at 8:07 AM Grassucci, Robert <
> rg2502 at cumc.columbia.edu> wrote:
>
> Dear Anastasia,
>
> We tried out the ultra-low profile Elsa and liked the ability to recover
> the grids but did not like the robustness of the clipping system.  We have
> a Gatan 914 holder and have had to replace the front spring on several
> occasions because it eventually gets bent or loose and no longer clamps the
> grid properly.  This may be why you are seeing with the leopard skin ice.
> The conduction on the grid may not be sufficient to maintain a temperature
> that will keep vitreous ice on the grid.  This holder is great for a very
> experienced and careful user but definitely not for general use.  That is
> our experience with the Elsa.  Hope it helps.
>
> Regards,
>
> Bob
>
>
>
> *From:* 3dem [mailto:3dem-bounces at ncmir.ucsd.edu] *On Behalf Of *Anastasia
> Gazi
> *Sent:* Wednesday, June 12, 2019 8:01 AM
> *To:* 3dem at ncmir.ucsd.edu
> *Subject:* Re: [3dem] Elsa cryo holder
>
>
>
> Dear all,
>
>
>
> I would be grateful if someone of you could share some more information
> related to the ELSA cryoholders.
>
>
>
> We extensively tried out the ultra-low profile (ULP) tip for 2 weeks and
> the results were quite controversial.
>
> The stability of the holder was amazing in comparison to our 626
> cryoholders but there was a regular appearing of leopard/orange skin on the
> grids.
>
> We believe that this might be related to leakage at the loading station
> but I wonder if someone else had the same experience with its own ELSA (ULP
> or standard tip profile).
>
>
>
>
>
> Thank you a lot for your help,
>
> Anastasia
>
>
>
> On Sat, 6 Jan 2018 at 00:38, David Michael Belnap <David.Belnap at utah.edu>
> wrote:
>
> I don’t know, Benjamin.  Elsa freezes things so fast that maybe she is
> really making vitreous ice!  :-)
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Jan 4, 2018, at 10:13 AM, Benjamin Bammes <bbammes at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> While I don't know anything about the holder, I find the name "Elsa" a bit
> humorous. For anyone with young kids who has watched the movie Frozen, you
> know that Elsa does two things: (1) She turns everything she touches to
> solid ice, and (2) She always wants to "let it go." Both of those things
> are undesirable for cryo holders! :-)
>
>
> ----
> *Benjamin Bammes*
>
>
>
> On Wed, Jan 3, 2018 at 9:21 PM, jamonshi <jamonshi at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Our local sales says
>
> "Gatan has not shipped any production 698 Elas holder yet. The holders
> won’t start shipping until March of 2018. Gatan cannot discover where they
> tested the holder, as that is not a complete product and the development is
> confidential."
>
> Cheers,
> Jian
>
>
>
> On 04/01/2018 06:36, Elizabeth Montabana wrote:
>
> Hi All
>
>
>
> I haven't seen any responses to this, but we are also curious about if
> anyone has purchased or tested an Elsa Cryo transfer holder and their
> opinion about it - particularly, if folks have been able to get high
> resolution data with it.
>
>
>
> thanks
>
> Liz Montabana
>
> Donner Labs, LBNL
>
>
>
> On Wed, Nov 29, 2017 at 4:54 AM, Anastasia Gazi <anadegaz at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> Hello all,
>
>
>
> We are considering the purchase of an Elsa Cryo transfer holder Model 698
> from Gatan. It is looking great on paper with its centrosymmetric design,
> extended hold time to 8h and everything but I am wondering if someone has
> already experience with it. Either with the standard profile holder or with
> the ultra-low one.
>
>
>
> Thank you for your help,
>
> Anastasia
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ==================================================
> Anastasia D. Gazi, PhD.
> Ultrastructural BioImaging unit,
> Départment de Biologie cellulaire et infection,
> Institut Pasteur
> 28, rue du Dr. Roux
> 75015 PARIS
> FRANCE
>
> agazi at pasteur.fr
>
> ==================================================
>
>
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